GDR Forum Index
Podcast Podcast
Dev Dev Logs
Search Search
RSS RSS
Register Register
Log in Log in
Reply to topic GDR Forum Index -> Game Developer's Refuge -> Should I bother finishing my WIP game?
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
PantsuPanic
Contributor

Joined: 10 Sep 2008
Posts: 103

PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:18 am    Post subject: Should I bother finishing my WIP game? Reply with quote



I've been working on my own game for about two months now. It's a cyberpunk digital novel-puzzle hybrid entitled Otherside Of The Obelisk. I did all the graphics, music, programming/scripting, writing, etc. It's currently about 10% complete, so I made what I have into a downloadable demo:

OSOTO.ZIP

Anyway if anyone can be bothered to play it, I wouldn't mind knowing what you think. Especially if you think I should bother finishing the game. My muse is currently waning, but it could go either way.
_________________
Real Games For Real Men
View user's profile Send private message
Ninkazu
Contributor

Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 482
Location: Seattle, WA
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Downloaded. I'll give it a go when I get back from work today.
_________________
Get woke. Stay woke. ~@deray
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Sirocco
Moderator

Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 9471
Location: Not Finland
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 6:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I shall have to try this when I get home. It looks quite unique.
_________________
NoOP / Reyn Time -- The $ is screwing everyone these days. (0xDB)
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
n29
Developer

Joined: 13 Sep 2005
Posts: 879

PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

YES! FINISH IT!!!!!

NOW!!!!
View user's profile Send private message
Sirocco
Moderator

Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 9471
Location: Not Finland
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not sure how much content is in the demo because I didn't actually finish it. I'll probably give it another go tomorrow, but I'm running a bit low on time, so here's my thoughts.

The good

I really didn't expect Multimedia Fusion to be able to pull off this much stuff. The simple effects you've employed during the chapter sequences, intros, etc are actually effective and don't look chunky or otherwise craptastic like you see in a lot of other fusion games. The visual style is odd, but consistent, and actually gives me the feeling of being in a dystopian near future. Musicially I prefer it when the tunes move toward more "airey" stuff such as the few songs in the beginning parts (almost Silent Hill-ish at times), but there wasn't anything in there that bothered me. I count that as a big plus.


The Meh

I don't mind reading a bunch of stuff -- I finished Hotel Dusk, so obviously I like to read. The narration seems to flow well and doesn't come off as hokey or overly cliche. I didn't find myself "clicking through" the convos like I did with Trace Memory a few nights ago (yeesh). However, as you know some people will be turned off by the non interactive portions, but you seem to be doing a decent job of keeping them broken up. If I had gotten farther I'd say more on this.


The bad

I guess Fusion isn't good when it comes to mouse detection. I found the tutorial antivirus battle impossibly hard. The "pucks" were so close I only had a few pixels of clearance between narrow walls, and if that didn't kill me, Fusion losing my "grip" on the puck did. If I moved the mouse more than a few pixels at a time the game would lose my grip on the puck, which usually resulted in it getting whacked by something before I could return to move it to safety. I'll try it tomorrow on my laptop and see if I can achieve better results. I quit after the fifth or sixth attempt at getting through the tutorial battle. I like the idea just fine, but Fusion just doesn't like my mouse, or something.


Overall I actually like where this is going. Combat needs some work, though.
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Ninkazu
Contributor

Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 482
Location: Seattle, WA
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let me preface this by saying that I only got up to the tutorial and loved ever bit of it until then. I was writing spelling bugs at the bottom (hell, I'll post them) so I could say, "fuck ya, finish. And by the way you might want to fix these for your finished product" but now I'm encouraged to say that if this battle system is in any way a large part of the game - and even the one was too much for me - then scrap it or start over with a better game development tool and better battle mechanics, because right now it's physically painful.

Let me explain in detail as to why I say this, so you can return to the project and fix it, since I seriously did like where it was going.

:Begin part of post I started writing before preface:

I agree with Sirocco on the bad. I'm currently trying the tutorial and the mouse detection sucks, which is aggravated by the surgical precision needed to accomplish the task. Currently on try... 10?
Noticed that if I want to let go of the mouse button reposition or stretch my arm (because I have bad RSI and using the mouse for even a few minutes hurt, and it's made worse by having to hold the button down), and try to click again, the antivirus will often jump a few pixels and will often destroy it because I'm near a wall.
...
Okay no, I won't try to finish. This hurts, is not fun, but it most definitely /could/ be. There are a lot of game mechanics to rethink, like, maybe, allow for people like me to use the keyboard? If the whole point of the game is to not experience the story (which I was seriously digging) and to be frustrated playing a harder version of operation with only the mouse... then by all means finish the game the way you're doing it, but I won't play it.

:Begin part I started even before the previous part:

And some "bugs" I'd like to file for your finished product to be nice and polished.
Chapter One in the server room -
diruption should be disruption
A use of your when it should be you're (These will drive me nuts) this was early, so I forgot to grab context for easy searching, but it's before "Oh, and before I forget!" (ironic, right?)

Virus Disrupter Help Screen -
Antiviral Reset says "rest" when it should be "reset"

:Back to the now:

Notice how I have "And" to start the last part. That's because I expected to have finished a long post of why the game rocked in front. You can see how it digressed upwards.

So, I agree with Sirocco on everything except the meh. I liked the reading. It didn't bother me at all.
_________________
Get woke. Stay woke. ~@deray
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Sirocco
Moderator

Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 9471
Location: Not Finland
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

So, I agree with Sirocco on everything except the meh. I liked the reading. It didn't bother me at all.


I think if I had gotten past the tutorial battle I'd have read enough to place the dialog firmly in the "good" category. Until then, I reserve judgment on that.
_________________
NoOP / Reyn Time -- The $ is screwing everyone these days. (0xDB)
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Gil
Developer

Joined: 14 Nov 2005
Posts: 2341
Location: Belgium
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Visually cool, but dear god, the battle system thingie is broken. It's so unforgiving and finicky that you die from ANY ultra small mistake.

It does show some promise though, the visual style and the story were interesting. I'd just go with another mechanic for the puzzling aspect, since this doesn't work.
_________________
PoV: I had to wear pants today. Fo shame!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
PantsuPanic
Contributor

Joined: 10 Sep 2008
Posts: 103

PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 3:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I appreciate all the constructive criticism guys. :) Especially on those spelling errors, I too hate spelling errors and grammatical mistakes in games, so I definitely want to avoid that.

Well it boils down to everything is decent/good except the hacking minigame. I'll admit I can beat the hacking minigame with no problem, but considering I was the one who made it, that doesn't count for much. I want some sort of minigame that people can enjoy while still finding increasingly challenging. And I will admit the click-detection on moving the antivirus balls is way too glitchy.

Unfortunately every hacking minigame I can think of that I've seen in other games always boiled down to a variant of Pipe Dream, which is just cliche as hell... so I wanted to avoid that as much as possible. However, Ninkazu nailed me when he said mine was just a harder version of "Operation". Yeah, I guess it kind of is in hindsight, and that just won't be good enough for the long run.

One thing to mention is that I was planning on letting the player actively engage in dynamic conversations later on in the game, you wouldn't always be simply reading what everyone says, but also influencing the outcome.

If I decide to finish this, I'll definitely completely rework the entire hacking minigame aspect, and do something totally different. But that's only if my muse comes back with a vengeance, right now it just seems to be on vacation.

Thanks again for the feedback guys. :D
_________________
Real Games For Real Men
View user's profile Send private message
Ninkazu
Contributor

Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 482
Location: Seattle, WA
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 4:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well you could send Jak and Daxter out to bring your muse back, but I hope you have a power cell to give them in return.
_________________
Get woke. Stay woke. ~@deray
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
xearthianx
Developer

Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 771
Location: USA! USA!
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya know, I didn't have any trouble beating the AV puzzle on my first try. It took me a while to figure out how all the different obstacles work exactly, but once I did, it was pretty easy.

I did see the mouse grab problem, that that's only if you mouse really quickly; you don't really need to. It's more about timing that sheer speed. You should never need to jerk the mouse around if you have your AV byte in position and move as soon as your path is clear.

That said, the mouse thing is clearly broken. And as soon as I finished the puzzle: BAM! Protection Fault. Illegal Access.

But the music is interesting enough not to be obnoxious after repeating many times, and the funk art style totally adds to the atmosphere, I think. The "NEXT" click target should be much bigger though. Like, maybe the whole screen.

Other than this, I have two criticisms. Or maybe more correctly, one suggestion and one question. First, as has been said, there's a lot of text to wade through. I don't mind setting the premise with cool backstory, or introducing the protagonist, or anything that directly moves the plot along. But some of the other minor details can probably be condensed to cut completely. While details like how she's feeling can help invest the player emotionally, the medium probably dictates (or at least suggests) that we don't need four pages of exposition regarding her emotional state and the contents of her GI tract.

Second, is Kai a common japanese girl's name? I have known an Akira or two in my day. But Kai sounds more chinese or maybe korean to me. I'm not saying it ain't a perfectly fine japanese name. Just I never heard it before.
_________________
Ionoclast Laboratories - Scientia et Dominatia!
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
xearthianx
Developer

Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 771
Location: USA! USA!
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is it possible you meant Aki (as in Akiko)? I just consulted an expert and he says Kai is not a name. Aki would just be the first two letters switched, which would be a pretty minor and easy typographical error to make...
_________________
Ionoclast Laboratories - Scientia et Dominatia!
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
PantsuPanic
Contributor

Joined: 10 Sep 2008
Posts: 103

PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think your expert is perhaps... not so expert.

Kai can be either a boy or a girl name in Japanese, like Ashley or Jesse can be as such in Western society.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kai_(given_name)

http://www.issendai.com/rpgs/japanese-girls-names-3.shtml

http://www.babynamescountry.com/meanings/Kai.html

http://www.mybabyname.com/baby-name-full-detail/kai/5026/1

Etc.

Kai can also be added to other Japanese names to form a larger name, such as Kaiko or Kairi to be distinctly female. Such as how "Alex" can be a female or male name, yet "-andra" can be added to form Alexandra which is distinctly more feminine to further differentiate (but necessarily needed as such).
_________________
Real Games For Real Men
View user's profile Send private message
Gil
Developer

Joined: 14 Nov 2005
Posts: 2341
Location: Belgium
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey, I was thinking about your demo and I just wanted to mention that you really should consider getting it finished. The visual and contextual statement is really bold, so it would be a waste not to at least reuse most of it.
_________________
PoV: I had to wear pants today. Fo shame!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
PoV
Moderator

Joined: 21 Aug 2005
Posts: 10977
Location: Canadia
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good set of naming resources BTW.
_________________
Mike Kasprzak
'eh whatever. I used to make AAA and Indie games | Ludum Dare | Blog | Tweetar
View user's profile Send private message
xearthianx
Developer

Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 771
Location: USA! USA!
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, just wanted to make sure. When I realized it was only one letter-swap away from Aki, it seemed irresponsible not to check with you.
_________________
Ionoclast Laboratories - Scientia et Dominatia!
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Reply to topic GDR Forum Index -> Game Developer's Refuge -> Should I bother finishing my WIP game?

Use this link to get a Sign-On Bonus when you get started!

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective owners. All comments owned by their respective posters.
phpBB code © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group. Other message board code © Kevin Reems.